How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

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How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by bokkins on Wed Apr 21, 2010 11:27 pm

Hi guys, I've been wanting to open this up dati pa. Gawin natin tong small discussion on how to properly criticize a work by colleagues to guide us into a better understanding of what we are doing.

Aside from the fact that we are super sensitive as artist, lalo na when it comes to our personal works. It is also important that we stress the points of improvement directly and objectively. Wala na sanang pasikot sikot pa o pasaring na tipong double meaning ang dating.

The goal of this thread is to develop a good sense of critic.

Below are some phrases or words that I personally do not like seeing in post: You may also share yours and suggests. Everybody is welcome to contribute.

1. parang may mali... or sa monitor ko lang. (what's the sense kung iba naman pala ang monitor mo di ba?)
2. nagtataka lang ako sa door (ground floor), parang grainy sya, o sa mata ko lang. (avoid na natin yung mga side comments na sa mata ko lang, hindi talaga nakakatulong sa pagimprove yan.)
3...

Ito naman ang mga suggestions ko on how to critic:
1. point out the mistakes
2. suggest solutions on how to improve them
3. explain why if you find anything odd
4. suggest references if you have time
5. go direct to the point
6. be objective
7. avoid unnecessary comments
8. avoid using local dialects for everyone to benefit from the discussions

Sa thread na to, sana maimprove natin ang pagcritic. Yung mga compliments naman, hayaan na muna natin, these are ego boosters which I have observed will help improve a persons mood. a happy mood means good everything. Smile

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by ERICK on Thu Apr 22, 2010 2:19 am

hmmm walang pumapansin dito ah... lemme add

3. ung tipong ang daming comments na kesyo mapping issue sa ganito, halata ung tiling, medyo ibahin mo ung design... tapos sa bandang dulo ng comment "overall aprub 2thumbsup " kaasar...

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by kurdaps! on Thu Apr 22, 2010 2:24 am

4. Minsan emoticons lang without any words, magsulat naman ok na yun kahit konti lang.

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by qcksilver on Thu Apr 22, 2010 2:56 am

5. madalas ung iba sasabihin wow galing kahit di pa naman ganoon kaganda,,mas gusto ko naman malaman ano dapat gawin pa kesa appriciate nila


Last edited by qcksilver_2005 on Thu Apr 22, 2010 3:03 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by keitzkoy on Thu Apr 22, 2010 3:00 am

this is a very good thread masters..tambay lang po ako,want to improve sa pag critique ng works ng iba..honestly 'di ko alam sasabihin if i find something wrong sa isang work, so 'di nalang ako nagcocomment, or positive lang icocomment ko, parang takot kasi na maoffend yung artist na gumawa..

so yun, my bad..

hope to improve on this one, thanks for this thread.. 2thumbsup

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by kurdaps! on Thu Apr 22, 2010 3:15 am

keitzkoy wrote:honestly 'di ko alam sasabihin if i find something wrong sa isang work, so 'di nalang ako nagcocomment, or positive lang icocomment ko, parang takot kasi na maoffend yung artist na gumawa..

so yun, my bad..


Ito ang dapat natin iwasan, matagal tayo matoto kung ganito iniisip natin. Take note, that we learn through our mistakes. Very Happy

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by mokong on Thu Apr 22, 2010 3:41 am

tama kayo mga bro.. minsan ganyan ako.. hehehe.. i try to be more objective sa susunod na mga comments ko.. mas maganda din cguro and I suggest evry post may standard na parang form kung baga.. from render setup to ligthing setup.. mas maganda kung ganun mga sir.. pra naman may reference tayo sa mga gawa ng iba at makatulong din tayo kung may mga dapat baguhin sa set up nila.. in this way give and take tayo ng mga ideas..

Parang ganito yung form..

Render setup:

1. Resolution = _________
2. Image Sapler = _________
3. Antialiasing filter = _______
4. Color mapping= _________
5. ........

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by 3DZONE on Thu Apr 22, 2010 3:54 am

6. Better put the appropriate title of the Thread.....wala na yung kung ano-anong titulo na hindi naman related sa images....

like this one... http://www.cgpinoy.org/architectural-f3/haay-buti-may-pambayad-sa-apartment-at-sa-napakamahal-na-tubig-at-kuryente-t11050.htm

sorry sir jhames ...parte lang ng discussion...

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by one9dew on Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:09 am

3DZONE wrote:6. Better put the appropriate title of the Thread.....wala na yung kung ano-anong titulo na hindi naman related sa images....

like this one... http://www.cgpinoy.org/architectural-f3/haay-buti-may-pambayad-sa-apartment-at-sa-napakamahal-na-tubig-at-kuryente-t11050.htm

sorry sir jhames ...parte lang ng discussion...

Agree ako dito sir 3d, nakatawag pansin sa akin,he2 Smile

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by hernandoloto on Wed Apr 28, 2010 8:24 pm

yap,agree ako sa inyo mga bosing, especially sa comment ni sir bokkins, to much critized doesnt help, instead give them tips how to do it the right way.

cheers....

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by hernandoloto on Wed Apr 28, 2010 8:35 pm

pahabol lang po, wla lang po sanang magagalit, di po sa akin galing ung comment na ito.
try not to use the words na " practice lang ang render" and then super ganda ng render, iba kc ang dating sa kanila na nag view ng post. you know...

cheers....

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by celes on Wed Apr 28, 2010 8:37 pm

7. avoid kiss-ass remarks. key to a good crit is to be neutral - but be completely honest.

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by nomeradona on Wed Apr 28, 2010 8:59 pm

Since this is a discussion, I think we should also point out the reasons and motives in asking criticism and giving criticism.

1. When you post your images...

- you are willing to learn and ask others what can be improved more to the scene. Many times, we need critical eyes to see those things. We need to ask feedback from them and not just with pure motive of showing how good is your output and receive praises... (ika nga masarap marinig ang papuri pero mahirap minsan lunukin ang pagkakamali).
- you bear in mind when someone point out the a flaw or an area that needs attention, its not about you nor your character but its about the work itself. so be willing to improve and learn but "not doing stuff to satisfy others like". you should satisfy your eye based on the critic...
- remember everyone wants to improve. even alex roman...

2. When you give critic.

- your main pure motive is to HELP others to improve. you have experience similar things before... someone has offered you help,
- you point out clearly what you can see and offer a possible solution,
- you avoid using Rude languages.. remember we have feelings and words can hurt... I do believe that you can still point a mistake using nice words,
- you avoid pointing the mistake directly to the person or their integrity.. rather, the mistake should be pointing away to the author, but pointing directly to the work.
- be truthful.


some other things maybe a little bit away from the topic but i think really useful..

3. If you are requesting the other party...

- be kind... you are not paying them, so if the answer is not there, please do not demand. Sometimes people gets tangled with their work and when they help, they sacrifice their personal time.

4. If you are a long timer here, do not boast as if you demand respect. Respect will come naturally if you work it out.. you cant demand it..

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by cloud20 on Sat May 01, 2010 7:50 pm

Saw this just this morning before going to bed...
---ganda,,,,post more....
---hintayin ko update hehehe
----ganda nito pag natapos.. update mo sir! (this immediately following the one above for cryin out loud)
---noted po sir.,tnx for the comment..,(but the next render still looks like the former where he promised to have taken note of the comments)
---Very nice design & render sir 2thumbsup Keep up the good work & post more 2thumbsup (this guy has cgp guru attached to his avatar; he has made that comment, if I'm not grossly mistaken, for all of his posts... ctrlV ctrlC)

& ad-infinitum-nausea; di tayo matatapos kung isusulat lahat yan dito...

I'm well aware that I have earned a nasty rep within the site as (to quote master Celestino) "palaaway"...
---I will always give my crit/comment as honest as I could & as concise as possible as well. But only to those who deserve it.
---I will most definitely humiliate those who take me for a stupid old dog but I will only do so after giving that person enough time to wisen up. I do this to those who are so thick skulled they refuse to see the error of their ways... Shocktherapy for lack of a better word... I really don't care if I become the devil incarnate within their minds; If i elicit some emotion from the festering passivity, I've done half the job. The other half, of course, is up to them...

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by logikpixel on Sat May 01, 2010 11:30 pm

@cloud: +1 for your thoughts. It's always fun and educational reading your posts. Ayokong magmalinis but I've had my share of "pinoy-cliché comments and ass-kissing" but I'm glad I've outgrown it. Akala ko ako lang ang nakapansin, cgpexpert, master, kung maka-comment ganun-ganun lang.

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by render master on Sat May 01, 2010 11:57 pm

- konting pihit ( alin kaya ang pipihitin)
- konting adjust pa ( alin naman ang iaadjust)
- konting practice pa ( with the same routine?)
- rush ( iwas pusoy syndrome 1)
- hintayin natin ang mga master ( nag-comment pa)
- repeatition of comments ( magbasa muna bago magcomment)
- low res lang ( iwas pusoy syndrome 2)


Last edited by render master on Sun May 02, 2010 12:14 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by kurdaps! on Sun May 02, 2010 12:09 am

tweak kunti sa lighting...

to be honest, I don't understand the meaning of 'tweak' in this phrase. study

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by pedio84 on Sun May 02, 2010 3:21 am

@ sir cloud : the " ctrl+C ctrl+V "akala ko kami lang ni bim nakapansin lol!


thanks to this thread,honestly tinamaan din ako pero at least naliwanagan na ang aking munting isipan

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by qcksilver on Sun May 02, 2010 3:36 am

kurdaps! wrote:tweak kunti sa lighting...

to be honest, I don't understand the meaning of 'tweak' in this phrase. study

tama ako rin di ko rin alam to,so i ask ung nagcomment sad to say di naman ako ni replayan

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by Muggz on Sun May 02, 2010 3:50 am

render master wrote:- konting pihit ( alin kaya ang pipihitin)
- konting adjust pa ( alin naman ang iaadjust)
- konting practice pa ( with the same routine?)
- rush ( iwas pusoy syndrome 1)
- hintayin natin ang mga master ( nag-comment pa)
- repeatition of comments ( magbasa muna bago magcomment)
- low res lang ( iwas pusoy syndrome 2)

i'll go with this one,,,minsan parang me notepad lang sa desktop yung nag bibigay ng comment at kina-copy paste lang,,, at sa mga nag popost naman sana mag bigay din naman kayo ng tips kung pano kayo nakakapag render ng 30mins render "rush" para matutu naman ang iba at di kayo nag mumukang nagyayabang sa mata ng mga kritiko,,,and sa title naman minsan ang layo na ng kinalaman sa post,,,meron pambayad utang daw,wala daw siyang magawa sa buhay,kasama niya syota niya,mahuhuli na siya sa trabaho,manung kung two-storey-two-storey tapos.

scratch


Last edited by Muggz on Sun May 02, 2010 5:19 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by archi_ram on Sun May 02, 2010 4:37 am

cloud20 wrote:Saw this just this morning before going to bed...
---ganda,,,,post more....
---hintayin ko update hehehe
----ganda nito pag natapos.. update mo sir! (this immediately following the one above for cryin out loud)
---noted po sir.,tnx for the comment..,(but the next render still looks like the former where he promised to have taken note of the comments)
---Very nice design & render sir 2thumbsup Keep up the good work & post more 2thumbsup (this guy has cgp guru attached to his avatar; he has made that comment, if I'm not grossly mistaken, for all of his posts... ctrlV ctrlC)

& ad-infinitum-nausea; di tayo matatapos kung isusulat lahat yan dito...

I'm well aware that I have earned a nasty rep within the site as (to quote master Celestino) "palaaway"...
---I will always give my crit/comment as honest as I could & as concise as possible as well. But only to those who deserve it.
---I will most definitely humiliate those who take me for a stupid old dog but I will only do so after giving that person enough time to wisen up. I do this to those who are so thick skulled they refuse to see the error of their ways... Shocktherapy for lack of a better word... I really don't care if I become the devil incarnate within their minds; If i elicit some emotion from the festering passivity, I've done half the job. The other half, of course, is up to them...
parang kilala ko to..ako yata to ay hindi pala ako guru....kidding aside, honestly tinamaan din ako dito...most of the time noong una yan din ang mga post comments ko sometimes until now but I realized pano kaya matuto kung ganun or ganito lang nakukuha natin sa comments ng iba...well I thank you for that comment but how will others appreciate you if ganun din ang comment mo, ang labas nyan nagbobolahan na lang tayo...di naman masama kung i appreciate mo pero mas lalong hindi masama kung maging honest ang opinon mo according to your criticism...sana mabago ko na din ang ctrlv ctrlc habit ko.....

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by yaug_03 on Sun May 02, 2010 5:41 am

Give it out your comments honestly kahit mga moderators or mga old members that earned their reputations here ang nagpost. Madalas kasi nahihiya (even me) to give my insights on their works.

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by Canadium on Sun May 02, 2010 9:39 am

For me, praising a work that is not good only pulls down the person who did the work. He may not improve his work and would churn out the same stuff over and over again and worse he will return the favor by praising other works that don't look good too. So in the end, everybody may be pulling everybody down unintentionally. Another form of crab mentality, I guess.


Last edited by Canadium on Sun May 02, 2010 3:02 pm; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : Added link and corrected sentence & typo)

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by exodus on Sun May 02, 2010 11:12 am

halata kasi yung comment sa isang myembro kung magaling ba sya o nang-aasar lang-ganito(o sa mata ko lang).parang ganun.

minsan hanga kaagad sa image kahit siguro thumbnail size pa lang..

low --ito po ung tinatawag na newbies or kakaexplore pa lang ng 3d,malalaman po natin ang isang membro kung
may alam kung anong tama.mostly ganito-(para sa akin excellent na to,ok na ok to para sa akin,pasilip
naman ng kunting settings dyan master)

medium --ito naman po yung neutral na pwedeng magcomment na parang master at pwede ring parang bagohan..

high --dito natin makikita mga comment kasi halata na may alam.at nagbibigay kaagad ng tips.minsan may comment
na hindi maintindihan ng newbies..

minsan kasi takot magcomment yung mga bagohan lalo na yung post nila eh hindi naman gaano kaganda sa thread na yun.baka sabihing"hindi mu nga naayos yung trbho mu,magcomment ka pa sa akin"..parang ganun po..possible po dba..kaya yung iba possitve comments na lang lahat...

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Re: How to criticize a work?! (A small discussion)

Post by rangalua on Sun May 02, 2010 11:58 am

archi_ram wrote:
cloud20 wrote:Saw this just this morning before going to bed...
---ganda,,,,post more....
---hintayin ko update hehehe
----ganda nito pag natapos.. update mo sir! (this immediately following the one above for cryin out loud)
---noted po sir.,tnx for the comment..,(but the next render still looks like the former where he promised to have taken note of the comments)
---Very nice design & render sir 2thumbsup Keep up the good work & post more 2thumbsup (this guy has cgp guru attached to his avatar; he has made that comment, if I'm not grossly mistaken, for all of his posts... ctrlV ctrlC)

& ad-infinitum-nausea; di tayo matatapos kung isusulat lahat yan dito...

I'm well aware that I have earned a nasty rep within the site as (to quote master Celestino) "palaaway"...
---I will always give my crit/comment as honest as I could & as concise as possible as well. But only to those who deserve it.
---I will most definitely humiliate those who take me for a stupid old dog but I will only do so after giving that person enough time to wisen up. I do this to those who are so thick skulled they refuse to see the error of their ways... Shocktherapy for lack of a better word... I really don't care if I become the devil incarnate within their minds; If i elicit some emotion from the festering passivity, I've done half the job. The other half, of course, is up to them...
parang kilala ko to..ako yata to ay hindi pala ako guru....kidding aside, honestly tinamaan din ako dito...most of the time noong una yan din ang mga post comments ko sometimes until now but I realized pano kaya matuto kung ganun or ganito lang nakukuha natin sa comments ng iba...well I thank you for that comment but how will others appreciate you if ganun din ang comment mo, ang labas nyan nagbobolahan na lang tayo...di naman masama kung i appreciate mo pero mas lalong hindi masama kung maging honest ang opinon mo according to your criticism...sana mabago ko na din ang ctrlv ctrlc habit ko.....


I know this guy master cloud & sir archi_ram.
but that guy didnt use ctrlV ctrlC, he typed it with heart - each & every posts
By the way thanks for the heads up- now he realized ( felt guilty )
"Food for thought"

Thank you very much guys.

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