Architectural Thesis (II)

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Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by pipicosis on Sat Jun 18, 2011 10:03 pm

No start na po ng thesis namin, and wala pa po akong concrete proposal dahil po bawal po kami magkapare-pareho ng proposals.

-So ang focus ko po ay sa agriculture.

-problem: iilan nalang po ang kabataang nag-aaral ng agriculture, at wala na pong gustong maging farmer. which is i think bad for an agriculture country like Philippines (Actually, even in other countries like japan). nagiging tingin po kasi ng kabataan sa Farming ay dirty job. iniisip nila na old school ito at pawang matatanda nalang ang nagsasaka.

-solution: gusto ko po sanang pagandahin ang pangalan ng Agriculture dito sa bansa,(or sa mundo). like make it entertaining, or more like up to date, by including latest technology and design to make farming easy. kung kakulangan sa area for farming, dito na po papasok ang vertical farming (but not highrise).
Or kahit po maipakita sa mga kabataan kung ano ang halaga ng agriculture, o ng farming, at mabago ang mentality nila. considering the word "EDUTAINMENT"



-problema ko po: what will be my proposal?
a School?
a midrise housing for relocation with farming area?
a techno-agriculture facility?
a zoo for Plants?...terrarium?...theme park for agriculture? (includes ecotourism)
or any suggestions?

considering the availability of data, and my time, what would you prefer po?

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by 3DZONE on Sat Jun 18, 2011 10:37 pm

why not, mas maganda nga yan eh, napakaraming lupa sa atin lalo na sa province. wala lang gustong mag maintain at magayos...pero kung pag-aaralan mong mabuti ang agriculture sa Pinas siguradong kikita ka. pagaralan mo lang yung tamang sukat ng lupa para sa gagawin mong project at hindi mo kailangan ng malaking lupa...isipin mo rin yung tamang irrigation at fertilization mo, yung tamang 2 tao lang eh kayang-kayang i-maintain...IMHO ito ang dapat mong ituloy...goodluck

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by pipicosis on Sat Jun 18, 2011 10:59 pm

salamat po sir, nakaka-uplift ng spirit na may sumasang-ayon. salamat po.
malaki po talaga ang magagawa natin kung magfocus ang bansa sa agriculture, kung hindi man masolusyunan ng RH bill at devorce bill ang over population, bigyan nalang natin ng trabaho ang napakaraming Pilipinong tao.


problema ko po ay ano specifically ang ipopropose ko?

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by silvercrown on Sat Jun 18, 2011 11:42 pm

pipicosis wrote:No start na po ng thesis namin, and wala pa po akong concrete proposal dahil po bawal po kami magkapare-pareho ng proposals.

-So ang focus ko po ay sa agriculture.

-problem: iilan nalang po ang kabataang nag-aaral ng agriculture, at wala na pong gustong maging farmer. which is i think bad for an agriculture country like Philippines (Actually, even in other countries like japan). nagiging tingin po kasi ng kabataan sa Farming ay dirty job. iniisip nila na old school ito at pawang matatanda nalang ang nagsasaka.

-solution: gusto ko po sanang pagandahin ang pangalan ng Agriculture dito sa bansa,(or sa mundo). like make it entertaining, or more like up to date, by including latest technology and design to make farming easy. kung kakulangan sa area for farming, dito na po papasok ang vertical farming (but not highrise).
Or kahit po maipakita sa mga kabataan kung ano ang halaga ng agriculture, o ng farming, at mabago ang mentality nila. considering the word "EDUTAINMENT"



-problema ko po: what will be my proposal?
a School?
a midrise housing for relocation with farming area?
a techno-agriculture facility?
a zoo for Plants?...terrarium?...theme park for agriculture? (includes ecotourism)
or any suggestions?

considering the availability of data, and my time, what would you prefer po?

With the current state of agriculture in our country, it's very difficult to be a farmer...
But i think we could make little steps to improve agriculture. so let's dwell on it...

I would base my suggestion sa proposition mo.

a School?
---anong klaseng school? school of agriculture? saan ang location, i think we have enough schools that offer BS agri and the like...

a midrise housing for relocation with farming area?
---I think it's not possible, you want to house the farmers in a midrise building?
Usually each farming family have it's own house within the farm, a silo that also function as storage for machineries and produce, a shed/ structure for farm animals... in short farmers needs huge spaces...

a techno-agriculture facility?
---I think this is a promising concept, try to work your way out of this idea.
It maybe a modern research facility, with modern tools and equipment that will be available for the local farmers to use, and the location is within a huge farming community. It may offer the services of both Dept of Agri and the NFA... it could be a semi-private entity under the Dept. of Agriculture and of the local farmers cooperative...

a zoo for Plants?...terrarium?...theme park for agriculture? (includes ecotourism)
---You mean botanical garden? these type of facilities could be in the agri school itself.


Last edited by silvercrown on Sun Jun 19, 2011 12:10 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by abed on Sat Jun 18, 2011 11:48 pm

may ganitong thesis sa ust at nag thesis of the year(2010) sa may Silang, Cavite site nya..patang entreprenuer exposition siya to educate more farmers with modern farming methods.

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by pipicosis on Sun Jun 19, 2011 12:55 am

silvercrown wrote:
pipicosis wrote:No start na po ng thesis namin, and wala pa po akong concrete proposal dahil po bawal po kami magkapare-pareho ng proposals.

-So ang focus ko po ay sa agriculture.

-problem: iilan nalang po ang kabataang nag-aaral ng agriculture, at wala na pong gustong maging farmer. which is i think bad for an agriculture country like Philippines (Actually, even in other countries like japan). nagiging tingin po kasi ng kabataan sa Farming ay dirty job. iniisip nila na old school ito at pawang matatanda nalang ang nagsasaka.

-solution: gusto ko po sanang pagandahin ang pangalan ng Agriculture dito sa bansa,(or sa mundo). like make it entertaining, or more like up to date, by including latest technology and design to make farming easy. kung kakulangan sa area for farming, dito na po papasok ang vertical farming (but not highrise).
Or kahit po maipakita sa mga kabataan kung ano ang halaga ng agriculture, o ng farming, at mabago ang mentality nila. considering the word "EDUTAINMENT"



-problema ko po: what will be my proposal?
a School?
a midrise housing for relocation with farming area?
a techno-agriculture facility?
a zoo for Plants?...terrarium?...theme park for agriculture? (includes ecotourism)
or any suggestions?

considering the availability of data, and my time, what would you prefer po?

With the current state of agriculture in our country, it's very difficult to be a farmer...
But i think we could make little steps to improve agriculture. so let's dwell on it...

I would base my suggestion sa proposition mo.

a School?
---anong klaseng school? school of agriculture? saan ang location, i think we have enough schools that offer BS agri and the like...

a midrise housing for relocation with farming area?
---I think it's not possible, you want to house the farmers in a midrise building?
Usually each farming family have it's own house within the farm, a silo that also function as storage for machineries and produce, a shed/ structure for farm animals... in short farmers needs huge spaces...

a techno-agriculture facility?
---I think this is a promising concept, try to work your way out of this idea.
It maybe a modern research facility, with modern tools and equipment that will be available for the local farmers to use, and the location is within a huge farming community. It may offer the services of both Dept of Agri and the NFA... it could be a semi-private entity under the Dept. of Agriculture and of the local farmers cooperative...

a zoo for Plants?...terrarium?...theme park for agriculture? (includes ecotourism)
---You mean botanical garden? these type of facilities could be in the agri school itself.


thanks po sir. possible site of all of these proposals ay sa Rizal, an agricultural province with fairly low profit in terms of farming. nakuha ko po iyong land use book nila at proposals and plans. priority po nila ang incorporation of technology sa agriculture ng province. maganda din po ang master plan nila for tourism, like ita-tranfer ang NAIA terminal sa Talim island in Binangonan Rizal, together with Laguna Lake Transportation program.

in terms naman po sa school, may doubt din po ako kung school major in agri.

sa housing naman po, may idea kaya naging mid rise ay para magamint po iyong height para din sa farming. whereas relocated naman po sila, they are obliged to work with each other. midrise din po siya to lessen din po ung lupa na tinatayuan ng bahay para maging farm nalang din po.

about naman po sa botanical garden, thats why i named it (but not final name) zoo for plant, is to exhibit po iyong mga plants scientifically. like gallery po. in cooperation din po sa mga proposals na ecotourims sa Rizal.

about sa Techno-agri facility, ito din po ang pumupukaw sa attention ko po pero po inaalala ko po ay iyong availability of data, considering po na sobrang late na ako.

salamat po ulit. nakatulong po ng sobra ito. salamat po sir

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by pipicosis on Sun Jun 19, 2011 12:57 am

abed wrote:may ganitong thesis sa ust at nag thesis of the year(2010) sa may Silang, Cavite site nya..patang entreprenuer exposition siya to educate more farmers with modern farming methods.

ideal nga po ang cavite for this project din.
kung hindi po ako po nagkakamali, iyong URBAN AGRICULTURE po ba iyong nagawa niya po? sana po malaman ko din po iyong name niya para po macontact ko din po siya. iyon po ay kung maari lang naman. salamat po sir.

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by pipicosis on Sun Jun 19, 2011 4:40 am

up

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by pipicosis on Sun Jun 19, 2011 7:01 am

additonal idea po pala sa housing na balak ko po ay implementation of "permaculture"
Permaculture is an approach to designing human settlements and agricultural systems. it is a sustainable land use design where the outputs of one element become the inputs of another.

Iyan po iyong basic concept ng permaculture and it has become a form of architecture of nature.

so parang single dwelling can sustain themselves having a small-scale farm.(not litterally sustain every little needs...impossible pa po iyon considering my abilities...pero possible naman po iyon)but somehow minimize the excessive consumption and dependance on fossil fuel.


Last edited by pipicosis on Mon Jun 20, 2011 2:00 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by pipicosis on Sun Jun 19, 2011 8:21 pm

up up bounce

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by pipicosis on Mon Jun 20, 2011 2:24 pm

Good day po. Suggestions po bounce

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by jamesalbert on Mon Jun 20, 2011 3:32 pm

alam mo sir medyo naghahalo na yung mga ideas mo at dahil diyan malilito ka kung ano-ano ang mga dapat mong gamiting concpet be specefic kung ano talaga ang concept mo try mo maganalysis ka muna magdrawing ka muna at pagunam-gunamin mo sa isip mo kung ano ba talaga ang dapat.....idea ko lang architecture is very expensive lets face it..so impisobleng mabigyan mo ng housing ang mga farmer but...... agriculture is not just for farmers the definition of agriculture must be bear in mind.....Agriculture is the cultivation of animals, plants, fungi and other life forms for food, fiber, and other products used to sustain life so ano maiisip mo???? kahit ako isang tao na normal ang pamumuhay pwede ko magtanim sa bakuran ko para di na ko bibili ng kelangan ko so in architecture how will you incorporate that.....ayun lang masasabi ko...kahit isang bahay na domestic pwede mo maincorporate ang agriculture....ayun Very Happy



nga pala site is very specific ahhh depende sa project mo suggestion ko lang if magiging tourist spot pala ang project mo may agritourism guidelines ang d.o.t ahh may mga piling site lang ang kelangan ng agritourism at guidelines po try to visit agencies like dep agri. and/if d.o.t

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by silvercrown on Mon Jun 20, 2011 7:53 pm

I would agree with the observation above... Sa daming idea na ini-entertain mo, di ka na makapag decide kung ano pipiliin mo.
I don't know kung anong idea or suggestion pa hinihintay mo.

While you have good ideas coming in, you have to sift through these information on what's going to be beneficial to you.
You have to bear in mind na this is an architectural thesis.
At the end of the day you will be judged and graded based on architectural criteria, Form and Function... that's the cue there for you!

Go out and do your research, visit the Dept. of Agriculture nearest you, and get as many info/ data as you can.
Visit their website, ask for interview, etc...

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by pipicosis on Tue Jun 21, 2011 8:14 am

salamat po sa advice. siguro nga po sa dami ng pumapasok sa isip ko ay nagugulo na ang path ko. sa sobrang pressure po kasi na nala-late na ko. nakausap ko na din po ang prof ko po.

sabi niya po ay regarding sa mga tao na ayaw na mag aral ng agriculture maybe hindi architectural ang solution. may point naman po pero still i'm striving to formulate idea.

naka set na din po ang lakad ko po sa DOT at Dep of Agri.
salamat po. medyo kumalma na po ako.

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by pipicosis on Tue Jun 21, 2011 8:24 am

jamesalbert wrote:alam mo sir medyo naghahalo na yung mga ideas mo at dahil diyan malilito ka kung ano-ano ang mga dapat mong gamiting concpet be specefic kung ano talaga ang concept mo try mo maganalysis ka muna magdrawing ka muna at pagunam-gunamin mo sa isip mo kung ano ba talaga ang dapat.....idea ko lang architecture is very expensive lets face it..so impisobleng mabigyan mo ng housing ang mga farmer but...... agriculture is not just for farmers the definition of agriculture must be bear in mind.....Agriculture is the cultivation of animals, plants, fungi and other life forms for food, fiber, and other products used to sustain life so ano maiisip mo???? kahit ako isang tao na normal ang pamumuhay pwede ko magtanim sa bakuran ko para di na ko bibili ng kelangan ko so in architecture how will you incorporate that.....ayun lang masasabi ko...kahit isang bahay na domestic pwede mo maincorporate ang agriculture....ayun Very Happy



nga pala site is very specific ahhh depende sa project mo suggestion ko lang if magiging tourist spot pala ang project mo may agritourism guidelines ang d.o.t ahh may mga piling site lang ang kelangan ng agritourism at guidelines po try to visit agencies like dep agri. and/if d.o.t


sir about po sa housing, ang target ko po talaga ay mamamayan ng rizal, (agricultural province) according sa rizal capitol ay well educated po ang families about sa traditional farming, ang aim naman po ng housing, or what i call agriculture community ay maeducate po sila about technology+agriculture at the same time with unity, at ipaalam na hindi naman nga po talaga kailangan ng malaking spasyo para sa effective farming (in complement with issue about agrarian reform). gaya po ng sabi ninyo ay sa simpleng bakuran ko lamang ay maaari na po akong magsimula ng agriculture. pero tama parin po kayo. i guess researches and interviews will solve my problem.

sana po gabayan ninyo po ako sa mga mangyayari po. kailangan ko po talaga ng support. salamat po talaga po.

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by silvercrown on Wed Jun 22, 2011 9:53 pm

It would be very interesting if you push your proposal, the housing system for farmers.
Ill reserve my comment when you have the full description and requirements of your project.

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by pipicosis on Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:26 am

I'm back po. with interviews and data. nakausap ko po ang head ng agriculture department ng rizal. and i'm afraid...mas pabor po sila sa URBANIZATION, meaning conversion of agricultural land to industrial, at mag import nalang ng goods from other countries like china, na ironic naman sa plataporma ni president Pnoy na maging self-sufficient ang pinas sa rice within 2015.
hindi ko po maisip kung magandang basis ba ito or hindi...

then about my proposal, sa san mateo rizal po ay talamak din ang conversion ng agricultural land at ginagawang HOUSING or SUBDIVISION. wherein dito din po consentrated ang population ng farmers sa Rizal.
i thought this is an opportunity sa proposal ko..
isa pa...as a farmer himself sabi po ng head ng agriculture ng rizal ay ang habit ng farmers ngayon ay mag farm within morning and afternoon, the time left are for other business dahil madaming choices ang farmers within a city.

somehow with a draft i come up with a CONDOMINIUM...
A condominium may be simply defined as an "apartment" that the resident "owns" as opposed to rents.

a farming condominium? a condominium that allows farming as a part time...or an obligation as a rule inside the condominium complex..

C&C po...i need po talaga ng critic.. salamt po

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by abed on Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:46 am

i think you should continue 1st idea mo to build a structure that would somewhat benefit/ educate them..bakit nga ba ganun trend nila? baka un na nga maging basis mo para icontinue yung proposal mo..para hindi mabawasan mga agricultural lands. Read about Planning, urban planning...yung discussion namin ngayon is conversion of agricultural to residential and its effects..sa Planning 3.


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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by pipicosis on Mon Jun 27, 2011 9:03 am

the reason po kung bakit nalalabuan po ako doon sa educate them is that i dont know what to propose...it cant be a school, govenrment is not open for proposals for research facility about agriculture, I think agritourism is my only chance...and i'm saving it for the last...if ever wala talaga..

salamat po. i would love to have a discussion pa po if pwede po

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by 3DZONE on Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:05 pm

i like you first proposal, dont look sa negative side ng area at pamamaraan ng local governent duon, try more hard sa perspective ng magandang proposal mo....ang target mo rito eh pangkabuhyan hindi titirhan...a simple farmer can live in a simple home (not a condominium) basta namumuhay sila ng tahimik at maayos...goodluck Very Happy

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by silvercrown on Thu Jun 30, 2011 8:14 am

pipicosis wrote:I'm back po. with interviews and data. nakausap ko po ang head ng agriculture department ng rizal. and i'm afraid...mas pabor po sila sa URBANIZATION, meaning conversion of agricultural land to industrial, at mag import nalang ng goods from other countries like china, na ironic naman sa plataporma ni president Pnoy na maging self-sufficient ang pinas sa rice within 2015.
hindi ko po maisip kung magandang basis ba ito or hindi...

then about my proposal, sa san mateo rizal po ay talamak din ang conversion ng agricultural land at ginagawang HOUSING or SUBDIVISION. wherein dito din po consentrated ang population ng farmers sa Rizal.
i thought this is an opportunity sa proposal ko..
isa pa...as a farmer himself sabi po ng head ng agriculture ng rizal ay ang habit ng farmers ngayon ay mag farm within morning and afternoon, the time left are for other business dahil madaming choices ang farmers within a city.

somehow with a draft i come up with a CONDOMINIUM...
A condominium may be simply defined as an "apartment" that the resident "owns" as opposed to rents.

a farming condominium? a condominium that allows farming as a part time...or an obligation as a rule inside the condominium complex..

C&C po...i need po talaga ng critic.. salamt po

To me it's not surprising, i think the province of Rizal and the local gov't is pushing for urbanization because of its close proximity with Metro Manila. As an example: They would rather have these agri lands converted into garbage dumps because it would earn more money, more revenue for the local gov't compared to the unstable business of agriculture...
As a result it would push agricultural area further to the hinterlands, and believe it or not we still have huge areas of uncultivated land. But then again, as you said it contradicts to what Pnoy said on self sufficiency on rice.
One negative effect of urbanization to agriculture is, All the existing agricultural infrastructures would be useless because nobody will be using it anymore, and the gov't will be spending money for new infra on newer agri locations.

A farming condo? it will not work.... you got to do your homework on this, were not talking about small gardens are we? study how thailand or vietnam do their agriculture, how farmers like to live, move, the space they need, equipments, animals they tend ,in short study their lifestyle... and housing them in a condo will not work... Study how US farming family do their thing too, and you'll never see a condo in there... It may work in on a communist system, like China wherein everybody works for everybody.
It may also work if you're thinking of having a huge Agri Company involve in your project, like what we have in Mindanao, huge multinational company's like Dole, Del Monte, Stanfilco have housing projects for their executives and workers. The vast plantation itself is a tourist attraction if you're thinking about agri-tourism, they've got golf course, club houses, hospitals, church and of course housing... I doubt if you're going this path bacuse of its enormous scope...
I would rather go with your 1st proposal, but locate it somewhere else, maybe in Nueva Ecija where theres a huge farming community that may benefit from the project.

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by pipicosis on Thu Jun 30, 2011 4:24 pm

silvercrown wrote:
pipicosis wrote:I'm back po. with interviews and data. nakausap ko po ang head ng agriculture department ng rizal. and i'm afraid...mas pabor po sila sa URBANIZATION, meaning conversion of agricultural land to industrial, at mag import nalang ng goods from other countries like china, na ironic naman sa plataporma ni president Pnoy na maging self-sufficient ang pinas sa rice within 2015.
hindi ko po maisip kung magandang basis ba ito or hindi...

then about my proposal, sa san mateo rizal po ay talamak din ang conversion ng agricultural land at ginagawang HOUSING or SUBDIVISION. wherein dito din po consentrated ang population ng farmers sa Rizal.
i thought this is an opportunity sa proposal ko..
isa pa...as a farmer himself sabi po ng head ng agriculture ng rizal ay ang habit ng farmers ngayon ay mag farm within morning and afternoon, the time left are for other business dahil madaming choices ang farmers within a city.

somehow with a draft i come up with a CONDOMINIUM...
A condominium may be simply defined as an "apartment" that the resident "owns" as opposed to rents.

a farming condominium? a condominium that allows farming as a part time...or an obligation as a rule inside the condominium complex..

C&C po...i need po talaga ng critic.. salamt po

To me it's not surprising, i think the province of Rizal and the local gov't is pushing for urbanization because of its close proximity with Metro Manila. As an example: They would rather have these agri lands converted into garbage dumps because it would earn more money, more revenue for the local gov't compared to the unstable business of agriculture...
As a result it would push agricultural area further to the hinterlands, and believe it or not we still have huge areas of uncultivated land. But then again, as you said it contradicts to what Pnoy said on self sufficiency on rice.
One negative effect of urbanization to agriculture is, All the existing agricultural infrastructures would be useless because nobody will be using it anymore, and the gov't will be spending money for new infra on newer agri locations.

A farming condo? it will not work.... you got to do your homework on this, were not talking about small gardens are we? study how thailand or vietnam do their agriculture, how farmers like to live, move, the space they need, equipments, animals they tend ,in short study their lifestyle... and housing them in a condo will not work... Study how US farming family do their thing too, and you'll never see a condo in there... It may work in on a communist system, like China wherein everybody works for everybody.
It may also work if you're thinking of having a huge Agri Company involve in your project, like what we have in Mindanao, huge multinational company's like Dole, Del Monte, Stanfilco have housing projects for their executives and workers. The vast plantation itself is a tourist attraction if you're thinking about agri-tourism, they've got golf course, club houses, hospitals, church and of course housing... I doubt if you're going this path bacuse of its enormous scope...
I would rather go with your 1st proposal, but locate it somewhere else, maybe in Nueva Ecija where theres a huge farming community that may benefit from the project.


thanks sir, i already discarded that condominium from my proposals, at this moment i'm working on a smaller scope...thanks po talaga sa critic...it helps a lot:bounce:

pipicosis
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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by pipicosis on Thu Jun 30, 2011 4:44 pm

June 30,
I presented my proposal to my professor "agricultural training center". handled by ATI (agricultural training institute) for region-IV A, it is like a TESDA for agriculture.

usually, sa previous activities po nila ay wala po silang facility to host workshops, seminars and trainings at covered court lang po ng bayan ang gamit nila. and they are completely supported by the government with regards to the law called AFMA ([b]AGRICULTURE AND FISHERIES [font="]MODERNIZATION ACT OF 1997).

it would house training rooms (hands on), convention area, workshops, laboratory, and small scale farms.

comment ni sir: its too small to be a thesis proposal, magpoprovide ka lang ng empty rooms diyan, hindi pa nga lalaki yan dito sa college building natin e.

pero mababago po ito depende sa population ng farmers na makukuha ko po mamaya sa capitol, but again, maliit po talaga ang scope...
any suggestions po or anything that i can include...i'm feeling down bounce

thanks

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by mammoo_03 on Fri Jul 01, 2011 1:52 am

i suggest to lessen the purpose of training rooms rather, some eco tourism concept, para may ROI ang facility mo. at the end of the day, your facility should sustain operation cost, etc...godbless and focus lang.

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

Post by xtianatix on Fri Jul 01, 2011 2:38 am

look at this sir. this is an entry of my prof and classmates in UP for the FuturArc 2011 competition. You can explore more on this.
http://www.futurarc.com/prize_winners/2011_professional/FAP_Prof_Winner/2nd.cfm

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Re: Architectural Thesis (II)

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